ROCHESTER, NY ~ 2013 Part 3, May

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

skygirlblue wrote:

I know this probably doesn't help, but I have watched many times when Durand in Columbus looked like she was gonna fall over from heat stroke...glassy eyed, panting so hard, pacing or standing so still you thought she was in a stupor..and yet she would continue to stand in the hot sun and not try to move those eggs to the shade!!! Made me crazy...

Hopefully, the tension was triggered because of the frustration of having to deal with the heat

I'm SO glad you brought that up... Yes, that's what it was like.. a stupor...

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

carly wrote:

Can't see the video from work - blocked but I'll check it out when I get home.

I know.. I'm sorry. I wish there was a way for me to show you this, but I think if you saw it on video vs. the stills, you'd get a better idea of what was transpiring.

I can post all the stills I took from Rfalconcam if you want. You can then sort of see what was happening minute to minute..

Kris G. · **Posted:** Fri May 31, 2013 11:52 am

carly wrote:

skygirlblue wrote:

I know this probably doesn't help, but I have watched many times when Durand in Columbus looked like she was gonna fall over from heat stroke...glassy eyed, panting so hard, pacing or standing so still you thought she was in a stupor..and yet she would continue to stand in the hot sun and not try to move those eggs to the shade!!! Made me crazy...

Hopefully, the tension was triggered because of the frustration of having to deal with the heat

That is good to know SGB. I expect there will be some tension between DC and Beauty over the feeding thing. Quite frankly, that she lets him do it so much is quite unique. How many times have we seen Lil Dad try to feed or any of the other tiercels that love too and they get quite aggressively told no or get chased off by the female. When Jack did it the other day here, O'Connor just flew right in and ripped the food away from him and told him to get lost and he did! They'll allow it once in awhile but several times a day, every day..very unique to me but maybe you guys have seen that at other sites that I don't watch?

I often wonder if it's because DC is not really intimidated by her as he should be - that that is the reason she just lets him do it. Last year she got upset a few times at him over it but perhaps with all their battling this year, she's hesitant to challenge him in case he responds aggressively and the babies might get hurt by accident if there was a scuffle of any sort in the box.

Maybe she's upset that the past 2 mornings she's had to go get food for them herself when he comes in with nothing plus he ate her cached food this AM?

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

So, MAK did tweet she saw DC picking at some of Beauty's leftovers. Don't know if that was plenty of food.

Another thing just went through my head.. I'n not sure where the temperature probe is for the box, but with 3 babies, Mom & Dad, it may be even hotter than what temp we are seeing.. So maybe Beauty was trying to get him to leave so as not to heat up the box more?

Again... little stumped over this one....

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

carly wrote:

Can't see the video from work - blocked but I'll check it out when I get home. If Beauty didn't trust DC, there would be no chicks in that nest box mw. She would kill him if she didnt' trust him and she leaves him with the their kids all the time. It's likely more of a 'role' issue, like I"m the mom and the kids and box are my domain, you're the tiercel..you hunt, clear the territory and babysit when I need you otherwise go back to your man cave!

He's kind of pushing the 'gender' boundaries, a bit of a gender-bender if you like :teehee:

That's true.. I think about Spark.. He's fed Zoom just a few times.. Durand does the feeding.

Clara in San Jose, wouldn't let EC in the box to feed the kids for what seemed like the first few weeks. This year, she and Fernando fed the kids more often.

Lil in SF would allow Dan to feed and we would see tandem feedings often in SF.

Yes, DC's enthusiasm for feeding is quite unique.

And regarding the tension/trust... this was NOTHING like her protecting her eggs from the unbanded male just 2 short weeks ago (can you believe it was only 2 weeks ago that we all were so upset, thinking DC may have lost his territory.. or worse?). If that tiercel was still here, there's a good chance we wouldn't be witnessing these scenes. That male didn't bring Beauty ANY meals. She was COMPLETELY on her own...

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

Was just watching video again. She bowed and chupped to him, also, she had her back to him. So I don't think it was threatening. I think it was more like "what's going on with you?"

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

12:12 - B just flew off.

Donna C · **Posted:** Fri May 31, 2013 12:20 pm

Everything is fine, Beauty didn't want him in the nest. They pant awfully, looks bad to us but it's what they do. Yes, the temp is hotter in there then what we see. DC has been getting plenty to eat, he preps and gets his quota then brings the rest to the nest, plus stealing B's cache when needed. Fear not, last year was much worse when little Orion went almost a whole day with no food. It's just too darn hot and the food ain't flying!! They know what they're doing. DC pushes the wrong buttons sometimes with Beauty. They are working more as a team this year then last year. It can only get better. :ohyes:

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

12:20 - Beauty has returned.

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

carly wrote:

I honestly don't know why people keep thinking only the tiercel should hunt? I think that's honestly misinformation as I have watched our site here daily for several years now with 2 females and both of them hunted as soon as the kids could thermoregulate or if Jack had no luck.

The females are the better hunters and they bring in larger prey that can feed more kids. I know even someone at banding said that the male does 'all the hunting' and I thought to myself do you ever watch different cams or nests daily? Both parents contribute, some tiercels are, like Lil Dad exceptional hunters but he's also got a decade of experience. Not each nest site is the same...they're not clones, they are affected very much by their environment and upbringing. Just because Kaver was a super tiercel, it's unfair to compare DC to him or Beauty to Mariah - they're very different birds.

Maybe it's a dual nesting thing - and DC certainly mimics his father - but I've seen jack catch food here and take it to his other site to feed his kids there. So I'm not sure, maybe E2 was the sole provider and Dorothy never hunted? But I doubt it given the size of broods she's had, it maybe what each learned at their respective nest sites.

You bring up a great point Carly. Our girls out here always hunt... Clara in SJ is an EXCELLENT hunter. I'm sure Lil was also. I was just reading an update on the Fruitvale family (Hiko + Tremaine + 4 kids) and both the parents are hunting.

Maybe when we watch a 1 eyas nest, less hunting needs to be done by the falcon because there are less mouths to feed.

And our tiercels always pick over leftovers. As Glenn Stewart would remind us.. if the parents don't eat, the kids don't eat... so when it was REALLY warm out here and we would see limited food deliveries, and we wondered what was happening.. We would see a parent in the distance eating, while we were yelling "feed the kids". But they had to eat so they remained strong to feed their family.

Donna C · **Posted:** Fri May 31, 2013 12:37 pm

With Beauty and DC both share the duties of hunting. Sure B waits to see if DC comes with food but if not, no biggie, she'll go out for a while. DC is always waiting in the wing for her to leave so he can bond with the wee ones. They crack me up!! DC's feeding skills have much improved also. He's young, he's learning and I believe he's liking every minute of it.

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

12:39 - Another baby on it's back... I don't like this... It can't get itself turned back over...Okay.. just did. That freaks me out a little...

Kris G. · **Posted:** Fri May 31, 2013 1:43 pm

carly wrote:

Sorry for going on and on with my posts but I get a frustrated when I think people can't think outside the box and try to compare apples and oranges.

Birds that nested in the wild 40 years ago dealt with different challenges than birds that nest in cities today so what's in those old birding books needs to be rewritten to acommodate for 'urban' falcons. Also, in Canada alone in the last decade - we've lost 30% of our small bird population and there are many different raptors that compete for food here in the cities. And having to worry about cougars and wild animals coming upon your nest doesn't exist for our urban falcons so very different environments to adjust too.

Then there is the comparing of long time established pairs against new parents or younger parents. I've read about all the great pairs. When they first started nesting in cities, populations were low of competing falcons and they weren't on cams early on so by the time we saw alot of them they were quite experienced. I'm sure they had their challenges in the first few years too before they went on to be 'legendary'.

Anyway..getting off soap box now.

I'm not saying that tiercels should do all the hunting -just tired of all the DC accolades with no credit as to what a great mom Beauty is. Beauty did lots of hunting for Orion last year when DC was spending time with Pigott and hunted for Jemison and Callidora. With so much adversities in her life, she remains extremely strong in every way. We also know the DC/Beauty relationship is not the strongest, most trusting union and the heat is a big factor now. I believe the nest box temperature reading comes from the Rochester airport.

MAK · **Joined:** Wed Apr 11, 2012 11:16 pm **Posts:** 48

I think people get alarmed too quickly (myself included) because we all are like mother hens with our beloved falcons. I don't think there's anything wrong with DC other than it's darn hot out there. And I'm sure Beauty is hot too and wants him to bring food. I'm a bit cranky myself when it's 90 degrees out. Orion fell backwards last year and he was ok. I watched the video mwplay put up and it didn't look like a seizure to me just trying to catch its balance and righting itself. :suchdrama:

MAK · **Joined:** Wed Apr 11, 2012 11:16 pm **Posts:** 48

carly wrote:

Actually we compliment Beauty alot, she is very much loved on this forum. I just stick up for DC more because he's not always loved by all - so that's my way of looking out for him. :girlyes:

I would run into traffic to save Beauty and her babies any day of the week.

And I would do the same for any other falcon-I love them all! Trust me I know about sticking up for Beauty as she has a bad rap for taking down Mariah. I don't think she'll ever be forgiven for that. It's the Peregrine way tho it's not to our liking it is what they do. It's all good Carly-I'll see you tomorrow at Franks' memorial if you are there. Joyce and I are coming up for it as we love our Canadian friends as well as their birds!

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

Kris G. wrote:

carly wrote:

Sorry for going on and on with my posts but I get a frustrated when I think people can't think outside the box and try to compare apples and oranges.

Birds that nested in the wild 40 years ago dealt with different challenges than birds that nest in cities today so what's in those old birding books needs to be rewritten to acommodate for 'urban' falcons. Also, in Canada alone in the last decade - we've lost 30% of our small bird population and there are many different raptors that compete for food here in the cities. And having to worry about cougars and wild animals coming upon your nest doesn't exist for our urban falcons so very different environments to adjust too.

Then there is the comparing of long time established pairs against new parents or younger parents. I've read about all the great pairs. When they first started nesting in cities, populations were low of competing falcons and they weren't on cams early on so by the time we saw alot of them they were quite experienced. I'm sure they had their challenges in the first few years too before they went on to be 'legendary'.

Anyway..getting off soap box now.

I'm not saying that tiercels should do all the hunting -just tired of all the DC accolades with no credit as to what a great mom Beauty is. Beauty did lots of hunting for Orion last year when DC was spending time with Pigott and hunted for Jemison and Callidora. With so much adversities in her life, she remains extremely strong in every way. We also know the DC/Beauty relationship is not the strongest, most trusting union and the heat is a big factor now. I believe the nest box temperature reading comes from the Rochester airport.

Kris, I'm sorry if I haven't stated how much I love Beauty and think she is an EXCELLENT mother and provider. If I haven't given her dual credit, shame on me. I think she is one strong, beautiful falcon. I love her personality. I love the way she interacts with her eyasses (I've only seen her with Orion and these 3). I never did get to watch her much with Archer. I felt so sorry for her in 2011 with the failed nest. She has been through so much and she is a survivor. She is a force to be reckoned with.

I'm also sorry if I seem to be a little slanted towards DC. I like his personality also. I don't like to see how their seasons start, but do like how they finish! I feel like DC doesn't get credit and gets knocked all the time because he does attempt to dual nest. No, it's not anything I personally like, but I can't control it. He's going to do what is in his nature. I guess when I read chat & some reports, it always seems to me it's perceived that he's a failure, or that something is wrong with him.

When the unbanded tiercel came in 2 weeks ago, I had the sense some were happy that DC may be gone. I'm sure most won't admit to that. And maybe I didn't understand the tone.. It seemed lots of people were "happy" that maybe the UT that Beauty was being courted by before DC's return was back. And then, there were so many who kept dwelling on "whose egg is it". I don't know. I know it is my problem, my looking at things with a certain slant.

I think both Beauty & DC are carrying their share this year. From what I can tell, he's been spending almost all his time in DT. And this has been Beauty's most successful clutch, so something must be working right for these two.

So again, I'm sorry if I haven't given Beauty her fair share. Quite honestly, I was so amazed at the job Beauty did 2 weeks ago dealing with the intruder and her loyalty. I honestly think she was instrumental in driving the UT out of the territory.

I worry about both Beauty and DC when they are away for longer than normal. I always feel I'm on edge at this site because I don't know what the next "threat" will be, or who will show up on deck. Strange, but true.

So, please know, going forward, if I haven't provided equal coverage to Beauty, I will definitely pay closer attention and acknowledge the wonderful falcon she is!

:flirty:

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

MAK wrote:

I think people get alarmed too quickly (myself included) because we all are like mother hens with our beloved falcons. I don't think there's anything wrong with DC other than it's darn hot out there. And I'm sure Beauty is hot too and wants him to bring food. I'm a bit cranky myself when it's 90 degrees out. Orion fell backwards last year and he was ok. I watched the video mwplay put up and it didn't look like a seizure to me just trying to catch its balance and righting itself. :suchdrama:

Yep. I worry about the heat with these little ones. If it was cold, Beauty would do a great job keeping them warm. With the heat, there's no way for them to cool down.

I think I panicked a little when DC was acting strange. Beauty was looking at him weird. Baby falls on its back...

I'll calm down...

:calm

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

1:51 - B flew off and returned with food and proceeded to feed the babies.
2:06 - from archives looks like she leaves with whatever leftovers there may be.
2:10 - from archives, returns.

2:16 - Beauty just took off, after looking up.
2:19 - Beauty returns, checks on eyasses.

Back to front lip of box.

2:20 - Beauty takes off again, after looking up.

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

2:27pm - Beauty is back.

When she's leaving, she's quiet.. no chupping or alarm calls. Maybe she's hunting...

mwplay · **Joined:** Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:15 am **Posts:** 10250

2:35pm - Food delivery by DC. B took it in box and started prepping it. Just flew off to clean it. DC to box with a small bit to feed kids while B works on larger portion.

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ROCHESTER, NY ~ 2013 Part 3, May

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