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 Post subject: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 12:04 am 
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PLEASE CONTINUE YOUR MONTREAL POSTS HERE!


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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 3:36 am 
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@Eve, Thank you so much for the video of Polly taking the little one.
It does't seem to be the youngest?
(see topic in archives).

I believe Spirit had no idea what Polly was doing, she didn't understand, and at the same time she kept feeling the (2) chicks under her.

Yesterday on UDM-archives there were some photo's of a bit of a strange prey in the nest. Could it be the chick having been returned to the nest by Roger? Dead of course, thus taken as a prey by Spirit? I'm not sure, maybe it's too big to be one of the chicks?


ImageImageImage

Feeding of it:

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 6:59 am 
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Spirit stayed with the chicks all night. This morning around at 6:28 AM local time the kids were fed with preyrests.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 9:40 am 
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Ooooh ... too horrible the grisly reality of raw nature write large before our eyes ... exactly why I have found it hard to return to watching nests too closely any more ... it sure aint sentimental!

Well that confirms it - she was yelling with jealousy.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 1:38 pm 
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Good grief--is it snowing there, Wizzz? It looks like blowing snow on the outside cam! :o

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 1:02 am 
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I think you think we have deserted you Wizzz. Not so. We are all just gathering ourselves after the event a few days ago.

I have a reply form one of our biologists and I have e-mailed him for permission to print it here. Hopefully I can. some good points and information.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 1:07 am 
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I have been gone all day but thank-you for pictures. I have jsut checked archives.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 7:31 am 
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Nothing special last night.
Spirit was on the chicks.
Roger came early this morning, pics from 5:14 Am and 5.25 Am.
At 5:36 Am Spirit was back on the chicks.

Roger
ImageImage
Spirit
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06.32 AM: chicks alone.
06.44 AM: Spirit with pray (maybe earlier, can't get picture).

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ImageImageImage
On the other cam:
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End of feeding
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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 8:55 am 
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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 10:49 am 
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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 10:57 am 
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thanks adriaantje for all the shots.
the chicks are sure growing.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 11:21 am 
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Sound seems to be gone, is that correct

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 11:56 am 
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Bev, I sure hope you may put the answer of the falconspecialist on topic.


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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 12:15 pm 
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I am just waiting his approval. I do not feel i can do it without his approval.

But if I do not hear form him soon I will try and paraphrase some of it.

He hopes that this is being well documented.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 2:23 pm 
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I had sent an e-mail out to our biologists about what happened here. I gave them the background on Polly and adults and told what had transpired so far . I told them about here injury and then just staying with adults. I told them about her coming in while they were on eggs and sometimes there being a stand off. I told them about here coming in when first 2 were born and just nudging them and then leaving and then I told what happened the other day.

One of the biologists was going to e-ail his falcon friend David Bird.

another gave me the O.K. to post his reply

Hi, Bev, et al.,

Every Peregrine webcam will show us something interesting. Occasionally the webcam events are extremely revealing about the plasticity and the limitations of the falcons' behavior.

I hope somebody keeps careful track of what transpires and writes up the events from the Montreal nest. This appears to be a well-documented, well-observed event.

From Bev's descriptions only (I've not been watching the website), I can offer a few comments.

I've watched as a male of a pair of captive breeding Merlins temporarily 'stole' some of the brood from under the female and brooded them a few cm away from the female. The drive to incubate or brood can be very strong!

With their beaks, raptors can pick up and carry tiny nestlings without damaging them.

Sometimes in (captive) circumstances in which the female apparently was confused, she may pick up and carry a nestling, then brood it, then pick it up again... In one case I've watched, everything was fine a hour later, and the nestling eventually was reared to fledging; in another case, an hour later the nestling was found dead, cached in a corner of the nest box, and the female was incubating the remaining (infertile) eggs.

In the literature there are a small number of cases of "threesomes" at falcon eyries, usually with a yearling (usually female) helping the adult breeding pair (apparently not always their own offspring of the previous year).
Observations have not clearly shown how these unusual situations arise.

Even when there were many high quality territories vacant, yearling Peregrines rarely took up those territories and tried to nest as one year olds.
Presumably the few that tried were especially high quality birds. The 'extra'
bird at the Montreal nest probably is not an exceptionally high quality, well nourished yearling, and so she may not be in 'full breeding condition'.

In captivity there have been a few observations in which some much older nestlings have been seen to feed much younger ones; in large nestlings or fledglings there appears to be a powerful instinctual urge to feed begging young falcons (but those were not tiny, recently hatched nestlings). As the spring progresses, perhaps Polly will become more 'maternal' and may properly
take on some parenting roles.

In Montreal, if the fledgling of the previous year had a leg injury, it is understandable that the parents might have cared for it as a dependent youngster into the fall and winter, and that it did not learn how to kill quarry and disperse when it normally would have. And if the adults remained on territory through the winter, it is understandable that the juvenile might become an accepted part of the "pair" and still be there in the spring. But, while we might like her to, we cannot expect the young bird to do the appropriate parenting behaviors. It may work out. Or it may not. I hope somebody watches closely and tells us what eventually happens.

Wayne

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 3:06 pm 
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Thanks for sharing Wayne's response, bev. It was interesting to read about similar (but not exact) situations he has witnessed. We will just have to wait and see what happens (duh). :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 3:06 pm 
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Thanks Bev for your post from Wayne...I don't think anyone knew what to expect from
Polly and how she would act with the new little ones. Maybe she wanted her own chick/baby?

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 3:38 pm 
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After reading between the lines, with what Wayne had to say, I really think that is what she was trying to do. (raise her own chick)She did take it to her nestbox first and got scared off by adult. I really ,in my heart of hearts, do nt believe she ate it.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 3:54 pm 
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Thanks from me too for posting Wayne's thoughts, Bev. I am more encouraged to think from what he said that maybe that chick is still alive & Polly is caring for it. We probably won't know until fledge time when she comes flying up to the box with a juvie in tow. (Well, that would be nice!) It was also encouraging that he said that a falcon can fly with a small one & the small one not be injured.

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 Post subject: Re: MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ MAY 9, 2010 - DEC 31, 2010
PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 3:58 pm 
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here is a shot ,I jsut took

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Probably missed a feed
and then quickly covered. soon will big to cover

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