MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ JAN - MAY 8, 2010

kittenface · **Posted:** Fri May 07, 2010 10:05 pm

Delete this if you want but all I can say is dam, I am so sorry everyone for this tragic loss :-(

obxbarb · **Posted:** Fri May 07, 2010 10:41 pm

I'm so sorry to hear this. Its a really unexpected turn of events for me too. I'm sure it will change the family dynamics.

One from early evening when the chicks were alone.

adriaantje · **Joined:** Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:45 am **Posts:** 413

Video (25 minutes)
The chicks alone, than Spirit comes in and goes out, than comes back with a prey, and follows a feeding. Then Polly comes in and goes out, and Spirit breeding the chicks.

http://www.livestream.com/fauconsudem?u ... ooterlinks

MESSAGE ON EVE'S BLOG YESTERDAY NIGHT
(ROUGHLY TRANSLATED BY ME):

Polly stole a baby away under Spirit tonight at about 18.30. I went outside and looked onder the roofs to see if the little one could have fallen and would be still alive. Without luck. What a sadness! Hopefullly she won’t make the same sort to the others.

We shouldn’t be mad at her, as she doesn’t have the instinct that tells her it’s something else than food. It is stonishing Spirit wasn’t more aggressive with her daughter. Let’s hope this situation will not be repeated.

adriaantje · **Joined:** Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:45 am **Posts:** 413

Spirit during the night and a while ago:

Beth · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 7:59 am

I am so sorry to hear this. We had hope that everything would work out.

skygirlblue · **Joined:** Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:18 pm **Posts:** 64757

Oh...that is just so sad and really breaks my heart....Spirit was actually sitting on them when Polly came in? Let's pray this doesn't happen again...

adriaantje · **Joined:** Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:45 am **Posts:** 413

Yes Skygirlblue, as I understand from Eve's message Spirit was on top of the little ones When Polly took the chicky. I tried to find images or a video of that moment, but the archive only shows video's until April 30 and of today. I couldn't find any pics either.
I know that Eve is giving a conference today (just now, terrible...) so I don't think she's going to appear here with or without a video of that moment.

I must say, I really don't understand how Polly came hereto. Normally peregrines understand very well the difference between a living prey and little baby peregrines. It seems to me she has been cleaning up the nest while her own mature female instincts are already responding right now.... it's very early indeed, but in a few officially studies and observations this has been mentioned already. Some of these youngsters even araised chicks successfully!!

Beth · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 9:04 am

Wonder why Spirit didn't fight or fuss at Polly when this was happening. I would think that
the instinct to protect the new little ones would be stronger than the bond to Polly.

If Roger would have be at the nest do you think it would have still happened?

adriaantje · **Joined:** Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:45 am **Posts:** 413

Beth, I've really no idea if this would have been possible with Roger in the nest.
If Polly is an aggressive and proud maturing peregrine, I think Roger could eventually even fall for her if she continues to impose herself and finishes by attacking Spirit.
But hopefully we will never attent this stade with Polly.

Here is a photo of a young lady in France (St Nicolas de Port, near Nancy). She is only one year old, but she chased the resident female and hes been seen while "copulating" (how do you say that?) with the resident male a few weeks ago. As there are no camera's there we depend on the persons observing on sight, but they aren't there all the time. I will ask Patrick Behr in France about new developments since.

SusanE · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 11:22 am

If there is one very important thing I learned from Froona it was that falcons don't have "feelings" but rather they operate their lives based on hormones which cycle during a season. She helped me to see that S2 of DeMortal was not being rude or mean when she first arrived at that nest; she was just going by what her hormones told her.

I am no expert by any means, but there does not seem to be any events (such as copulating or egg laying) that would trigger the maternal hormones/instinct in Polly. All I have ever seen from her was aggression.

Edit: I should add that this does not make Polly a bad falcon; she's just functioning on her hormones.

catwoman · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 11:38 am

I'm still wondering if possibly Polly took the baby to the other nestbox & is brooding it. Especially if she was acting on her hormones--she might have wanted a chick to take care of. I know its difficult for a peregrine to pick up a chick without hurting it, but it could possibly be still alive. The Maine mom was able to pick up Feisty last year & pull her back into the nest without apparent injury, but flying with the chick would probably be a different story.

Eve must be just devastated by these events--so sorry, Eve!

skygirlblue · **Joined:** Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:18 pm **Posts:** 64757

Thanks for bringing that up, Susan..you are so right, Polly doesn't have the hormones produced by egg laying or hearing those eggs hatch and chirp back at you...here's my wild fantasy..that she took the little one back to "her box"...of course, I know that did not happen...but its my "fantasy" for today...

we haven't brought this word out this season~anthropomorphism.

skygirlblue · **Joined:** Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:18 pm **Posts:** 64757

Funny, Catwoman...we have been thinking the same thing...

SusanE · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 11:49 am

It looks like Spirit has prey in the nest with her . . . maybe hoping that if Polly comes back she will take that rather than one of the chicks . . . ?

bev. · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 11:51 am

that thought Nancy and SGB was my only way to sleep last night.
I am still devastated by this. I have e-mailed our biologists for theri insight on it.

But I still cannot watch in case my next nighttmare comes true.
and now I will take a break form the cams
NO offense to you EVe, just me
I did notice though how mom slept last night. every square inch of chicks covered

bev. · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 11:52 am

Or Susan, she does not plan on leaving nest

adriaantje · **Joined:** Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:45 am **Posts:** 413

SusanE: I don't think Polly could possibly have some hormon activity to be able to copulate right now. She still and only is a dominant young female now. But we should know it remains possible these changes, especially since yesterday. I would like to explain it in an other way... (Polly taking the little one with her to get breeding on her own).

Human thoughts? :think

catwoman · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 1:06 pm

I just watched a feeding & saw a peregrine on the outside perch at the time making gentle calls. I was hoping it was Roger & I think it was. Whoever it was flew away before the feeding was done.

kittenface · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 1:17 pm

does anyone know who or what this is in the right lower corner?

catwoman · **Posted:** Sat May 08, 2010 2:13 pm

I don't think that's anybody, Kittenface. It has been there a while & I think its just a distortion of the cam.

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MONTREAL, QUEBEC ~ JAN - MAY 8, 2010

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